Opening up a Turkish restaurant in England

Anyone any ideas on the pros and cons of opening a Turkish restaurant in England? It's not my venture, incase anyones wondering, I'm asking for a friend of mine who's husband wants to open one up. I think it's risky but any views or experience of running one would be nice to show her.

Thanks.

The main risks are if he is going into the business with a partner or partners. The paperwork/licences etc are not difficult and are usually a formality. Overheads are large in a restaurant businsss, less so in a takeaway establishment. He'll need a good accountant.

And to be honest, in this economy, I wouldn't risk starting up a restaurant business. Eating out is still a luxury for many, and if belts are still tight, the restaurant business is one of the first to suffer.

Elaine

Hi THD,

From the little I know and what I've heard and read about running a restaurant in the UK, is that two thirds of them close down within the first few years. To run a successful restaurant you need knowledge, business experience (good chefs!) good location, marketing....the list is endless actually. It's a very competitive business, which is why so many of them go bust. And then you have to factor in that you'll probably not see a profit for the first couple of years; for some reason so many Turkish men seem to think they'll come to the UK and open up a really busy, successful restaurant, but what they forgot to realise is that they have to invest money into starting one up! And before you start making a profit you have to recoup all that money you've spent in opening it.

You also need to know about food hygiene, ordering foodstuffs - if you don't have the experience you'll end up with wastage, or having to tell customers dishes 'are off the menu'. There's an awful lot involved in running a restaurant, and I'd imagine it's really hard work. Long, unsociable hours etc. I have a friend who's a restaurateur and is very successful, but that's due to him putting in a large investment, having excellent business skills, heaps of experience and serving great food etc. I think his turnover is in the region of something like about £20k a week, but he told me (when he was a bit tipsy) that his profit after everything is just £2,500 a week - and that's open 7 days a week.....

I think it all depends on so many factors whether or not it can be successful, and as Elaine says, with the economy as it is at the moment it probably wouldn't be the best time to open one, unless you really had masses of business acumen and knew what you were doing. I actually think location is important, too; although people will travel quite a way for a good restaurant - if the food is excellent.

Having said all that about competition, location etc - the Turkish restaurants down Green Lanes are always busy and bustling - and the competition down there is huge! AND there's parking problems during the day, but they all seem to be doing well. Mind you, Turkish food is generally on the inexpensive side, so you'd expect cheaper restaurants to be even busier in an economic downturn.

Elaine, why do you say it's risky going into business with a partner? I remember you saying your husband went into partnership, and then the restaurant closed - was the partner instrumental in that in some way? Sorry if that sounds intrusive and nosey, but forewarned is forearmed as they say.

Anyway, that's my inexperienced tuppence-worth on running a restaurant, and I don't really think I've helped much!

Strawbs

I noticed Turkish men all want to run restaurants or barbers! Those takings Strawbs of £20,000 week seems a lot!

Sal

Hi Sal,

You're right - lots of Turks do all seem to think they're going to start an empire of successful restaurants in the UK - when the only experience of the food industry they have is serving plates of mezes in resort restaurants or local Turkish lokantas - or preparing kebabs and chopping up salad.

Those figures I gave you, Sal, are actually an underestimate. I spoke to my friend only yesterday and his takings are actually more in the region of £32k a week - but his profit is as I said - approximately £2,500 - but that's pure profit after everything. It's all his. I guessed off the top of my head he had about 60 customers a day, but in fact, he has an average of 100 - sometimes 150, though that's unusual, so his turnover is higher than I thought.

I suppose his restaurant is possibly on the pricey side (fillet steaks are £25) but sea bass is about £14 - which is pretty standard down here and at his type of establishment. Ertie and I go to eat there quite a lot, and the average bill comes to about £90 - sometimes more, sometimes less. When you tot up all the aperitifs, starters, main course, vegetables, pudding, wine, coffee, liquers - it all adds up.

The point I'm making is that even with that turnover of £32k a week, his profit margin is quite small in comparison. And his is a successful and very popular restaurant. Obviously, prices vary from restaurant to restaurant and town to town - London and Surrey is expensive - I realise that. But we still have your local kebab take-aways and KFC's - and I'm sure their prices are pretty standard over the whole country.

I'm still waiting for Elaine to come on and tell us why it's risky going into a business with a partner - if you've got a good accountant and lawyer - and have drawn up legal contracts I can't really see the problem. I'm sure she'll be on soon, though, to tell us..

Strawbs

Thanks girls, there's some great tips there. I'll show my friend them and hope more will come as well....the more the merrier.

Thats often the sticking point with business partners who are all Turkish - getting the partnership down on paper, notarised, and tight as a ducks bum. Fahri had one partner when the Bodrum opened, who had no experience in the restaurant business at all, and he really did expect the money to be literally rolling through the doors almost as soon as they opened the place. He became disillusioned with the restaurant business pretty quickly.

Elaine

Yep now you explained the figures Strawbs I can see how turnover will be big in some places, not so everywhere else sadly. Good topic btw THD Silansmum arent you only a partner after you've signed the paperwork? It has to be done legal or there not a partner Its a shame your place didn't take off whats hubby doing now? Sal x

I think you're right Strawbs - lots of Turks do seem to think it's dead easy to start a restaurant business and that it'll be an overnight success and lucrative cash cow. I always wince when I read a post from an eager-to-please newlywed woman posting that her "hubby" wants to start his own business here and asking how easy is it to do.

For the most part they use their experiences of working in or knowing the Turkish resort restaurant trade as a yardstick for success here and think the model is instantly transferrable. They grab the first Turk they come into contact with here, who they've become instant overnight friends with and seems to be up for it to go into partnership with. As Elaine rightly points out, these partnerships are rarely, if ever, valid, legally binding business transactions as we'd recognise them and in their world a lot rides on trust and a handshake. When times get tough and friendships fall by the wayside it's a different story...

As we all know, Turks are absolutely obsessed with money and being their own boss too and they will naively and simply assume restaurant = money (and lots of it!) and getting to be your own boss too. The fact is, the equation is never that simple. Try telling them that though, they seem to be extremely blinkered and only willing to listen to other Turks, however clueless.

They want to rush into it bull at a gate. They think they know all that needs to be known and would probably be extremely reluctant to say the least to take advice, however sound, from non Turks or do the necessary careful research of the local area and market before even embarking on the project. They think finding sitable premises at the right price and having someone to do the cooking and watch the till is all it takes. The customers will miraculously roll in, along with the money!

I know all this because my husband knows of several Turks who have taken this exact approach and failed in their attempts to open a successful restaurant business here in this country. We've been invited to a couple of opening nights in such restaurants and enjoyed the food only to hear that they've folded a couple of months later. It's a shame really.

Hi Judith,

Oh, you're absolutely right. But some people don't want to listen to sound advice, or they assume you must be jealous! lol That's one of the things these Turks have in common with numpties - they all wear blinkers - and never do any research or homework. Running any business is incredibly hard, especially in the first few years. You need tons of stamina, hard work, business acumen - and even then you can come unstuck. Even Gordon Ramsay has had to close some of his restaurants - and he's nobodies fool.

I remember watching Dragons Den and Peter Jones said the last thing he'd ever invest in is a restaurant - it's so high risk. I think what a lot Turks fail to realise is that many of the established restaurants they see bustling with customers have been going for years and years. So for an inexperienced person to open one up (possibly after taking out a bank loan) is akin to financial suicide - especially in this present economic climate.

All busineses come with headaches and problems; if it was as simple as some of these people think, everybody would have their own busineses and be rolling in the money. I'm always astonished at how naive some people are when it comes to opening a restaurant - I'm sure a lot of these Turks like to do it not just for the money - but for what they perceive to be the prestige of having their own business, so they can brag about it to their friends back in Turkey. It's those tpes who always fail.

Strawbs

Girls you've been fantastic with your advice. Thank you all so much...........